O'er Windswept Golden Fields: Rules Attempt 1 the OSR way
So here is my first idea. We take a page out of Bloodbourne's design book. They didn't want people to be defensive so they got rid of shields except for a crappy wooden one that might be useful in some situations but mostly just wasn't useful in the same way they were before. Such will be combat. Its usefulness will diminish and change, making combat a niche way of solving problems while the rest of the game remains a fairly standard OSR system.
Main Mechanic: Roll under a stat on a d20. Players make most rolls.
Stats: Roll 2d6+4 down the line. Record the highest die rolled for your Tough.
Wits: Smarts, using ranged weapons, using items. Rolling marbles behind you will always work but a successful Wits check makes them more effective.
Tough: Affects health, physical endurance, physical strength, and using melee weapons. The highest die you rolled for your Tough +1 is your Stamina.
Nimble: Affects agility, running, jumping, climbing, and dodging.
Spirit: Strength of the heart, mental endurance, ability to make friends, and getting people to believe you.
Stamina: Gain Stamina equal to the highest die rolled for your Tough+1. Stamina measures your mental and physical stress. You don't die when you hit 0 or less but you do become Tuckered Out. A Tuckered Out kid is basically incapacitated, falling over from fatigue, crying from fear, ect. A Tuckered Out character can be revived with 1 Stamina with a successful Spirit check by an ally.
For gear roll on the tables here. Each kid will have a Backpack with 10 slots and 2 belt slots. You can draw something from a belt slot without any cost, but it takes an action to Root Around in your backpack.
Root Around: Roll a Wits Check. On a success, you pull out the desired object from your backpack. On a failure roll 1d10 and compare it to your item slots. If you roll 1 you take out the item inthe first slot, if you roll a 5, pull out the 5th, and so on.
A Deal with Sam Slick: You can reroll a check by taking a penalty depending on what the task was. For example, if you want to run away, you can reroll with the possibility of being successful but something will fall out of your pack as you run. Or your stick might break if you hit an enemy. A fine penalty might be the loss of a Stamina when other options don't make sense. This penalty ought to be negotiated with the GM before the reroll is made.
Hit it with a Stick: If you want to strike a target with a melee weapon, roll a Tough check. On a success, you deal 1d3 damage (A regular adult will have 10 HP) and a creature that hasn't been struck in this manner during this encounter will be Stunned for a round (Miss their turn). A regular penalty for Deals with this action is to break whatever weapon is being used to hit.
Throw a Rock at It!: If you want to strike a target with a ranged weapon or thrown object, roll a Wits check. On a success, you deal 1d3 damage and a creature that hasn't been struck in this manner during this encounter will be Stunned for a round. A regular penalty for Deals with this action is to run out of ammunition. (There is no ammo in this game besides this.)
Initiative: To keep the game flowing smoothly from normal situations to dangerous ones, in every "combat" situation pcs go first in whatever order they please followed by all enemies. Since combat is no longer so much of a central mechanism, the game shouldn't have an initiative system that completely changes gears for it.
Enemies:
Enemies will still have weakness and can respond to different sources of damage in different ways but now there will be a universal system for hitting them that will not be as repetitive. All enemy attack will be dealt with pcs making checks to see if they defend themselves. If there is a question if an enemy is strong enough to do a particular task, roll d6s equal to their HD and if any show 6, they can.
Enemies will not be able to kill pcs outright. Tuckered Out pcs will always be captured, cursed, or whatever else gives time for their allies to come and save them. For instance, the Junk Goblins cook their meals alive so the kids can come in to save their allies from slowly roasting over a pit. A witch might want to fatten up her captured children before putting them in her oven. A dark creature might curse a kid and the curse must be lifted in a specific way. Kids can die if their allies fail to save them but there must always be a chance to do so.
Thoughts:
A benefit to this system is that if you want your kids to be able to fight lots of little enemies that kids would be able to fight, they can. Also, it keeps a fairly slick and simple OSR ruleset. Honestly, if I were to do a PbTA system for this, I wouldn't change too much but the wording and format. I already drew a little bit from such games in creating these rules.
A negative might be that some of it feels pretty gamey? It is a little simulationist in some ways which might strike some readers the wrong way but I was going for a specific style of play and wanted this to be it. Honestly, I like it and feel that I am close on the trail of a game I would really love. I already have an idea for an adventure that I need to get on paper.
Tell me what you think. Let me have it! I want to do this game idea the justice it deserves!
By Nicholas Kennedy found on Pinterest
Main Mechanic: Roll under a stat on a d20. Players make most rolls.
Stats: Roll 2d6+4 down the line. Record the highest die rolled for your Tough.
Wits: Smarts, using ranged weapons, using items. Rolling marbles behind you will always work but a successful Wits check makes them more effective.
Tough: Affects health, physical endurance, physical strength, and using melee weapons. The highest die you rolled for your Tough +1 is your Stamina.
Nimble: Affects agility, running, jumping, climbing, and dodging.
Spirit: Strength of the heart, mental endurance, ability to make friends, and getting people to believe you.
Stamina: Gain Stamina equal to the highest die rolled for your Tough+1. Stamina measures your mental and physical stress. You don't die when you hit 0 or less but you do become Tuckered Out. A Tuckered Out kid is basically incapacitated, falling over from fatigue, crying from fear, ect. A Tuckered Out character can be revived with 1 Stamina with a successful Spirit check by an ally.
For gear roll on the tables here. Each kid will have a Backpack with 10 slots and 2 belt slots. You can draw something from a belt slot without any cost, but it takes an action to Root Around in your backpack.
Root Around: Roll a Wits Check. On a success, you pull out the desired object from your backpack. On a failure roll 1d10 and compare it to your item slots. If you roll 1 you take out the item inthe first slot, if you roll a 5, pull out the 5th, and so on.
A Deal with Sam Slick: You can reroll a check by taking a penalty depending on what the task was. For example, if you want to run away, you can reroll with the possibility of being successful but something will fall out of your pack as you run. Or your stick might break if you hit an enemy. A fine penalty might be the loss of a Stamina when other options don't make sense. This penalty ought to be negotiated with the GM before the reroll is made.
Hit it with a Stick: If you want to strike a target with a melee weapon, roll a Tough check. On a success, you deal 1d3 damage (A regular adult will have 10 HP) and a creature that hasn't been struck in this manner during this encounter will be Stunned for a round (Miss their turn). A regular penalty for Deals with this action is to break whatever weapon is being used to hit.
Throw a Rock at It!: If you want to strike a target with a ranged weapon or thrown object, roll a Wits check. On a success, you deal 1d3 damage and a creature that hasn't been struck in this manner during this encounter will be Stunned for a round. A regular penalty for Deals with this action is to run out of ammunition. (There is no ammo in this game besides this.)
Initiative: To keep the game flowing smoothly from normal situations to dangerous ones, in every "combat" situation pcs go first in whatever order they please followed by all enemies. Since combat is no longer so much of a central mechanism, the game shouldn't have an initiative system that completely changes gears for it.
Enemies:
Enemies will still have weakness and can respond to different sources of damage in different ways but now there will be a universal system for hitting them that will not be as repetitive. All enemy attack will be dealt with pcs making checks to see if they defend themselves. If there is a question if an enemy is strong enough to do a particular task, roll d6s equal to their HD and if any show 6, they can.
Enemies will not be able to kill pcs outright. Tuckered Out pcs will always be captured, cursed, or whatever else gives time for their allies to come and save them. For instance, the Junk Goblins cook their meals alive so the kids can come in to save their allies from slowly roasting over a pit. A witch might want to fatten up her captured children before putting them in her oven. A dark creature might curse a kid and the curse must be lifted in a specific way. Kids can die if their allies fail to save them but there must always be a chance to do so.
Thoughts:
A benefit to this system is that if you want your kids to be able to fight lots of little enemies that kids would be able to fight, they can. Also, it keeps a fairly slick and simple OSR ruleset. Honestly, if I were to do a PbTA system for this, I wouldn't change too much but the wording and format. I already drew a little bit from such games in creating these rules.
A negative might be that some of it feels pretty gamey? It is a little simulationist in some ways which might strike some readers the wrong way but I was going for a specific style of play and wanted this to be it. Honestly, I like it and feel that I am close on the trail of a game I would really love. I already have an idea for an adventure that I need to get on paper.
Tell me what you think. Let me have it! I want to do this game idea the justice it deserves!
I think generally these mechanics make a lot of sense, and I like some of the naming conventions, like "Tuckered Out" for kids getting incapacitated.
ReplyDeleteI think the wits and spirit stats in particular could risk turning things like player skill or social roleplay into a roll, so I think some careful thought into how to frame those skills is going to be important, but it seems like you're already thinking about that.
The root around action could be hilarious in a comedy of errors sort of way, but I could also see it being annoying and just slowing things down. I think it'll really depend on how things are framed, the versatility or "fun" of the items, and of course the group. I think if the game is designed in such a way that even the "wrong" item could have some use, or at least be fun/funny, then it could be great.
Rather than a reroll, I think "a deal with sam slick" should just be integrated into the roll itself, like a degrees of success / failure system, or something like a GM intrusion from Cypher. Cutting back on multiple rolls for a single action is generally the better way to go. In any case, I do appreciate the fail-forward idea of it and again I think the name makes it fit well thematically.
In regards to hit it with a stick / throw a rock at it, I actually kind of questions whether this game needs damage/HP at all. In regards to making the game more OSR, and in-line with childrens fairytales, I kind of think it should be less about fighting monsters, and more about using home alone-style traps, or outwitting them, or using their own rules or abilities against them. Even if at a certain point it's just re-flavoring combat mechanics, that to me seems to be more in-line with what your stated intentions were for this setting. Hit it / Throw it as a one-time per enemy per combat, stop-gap solution to buy a moment of time is reasonable, but to even give it a damage die I think sets the wrong tone for how those actions should be used.
Anyway, have not had coffee yet so I hope those thoughts are coherent, I hope none of that sounds too critical, on the whole I think this is great!
You are making perfect sense!
DeleteI can see Wits and Spirit rising turning player skill into a roll. That is to be avoided. I ought to have Spirit affect a Reaction table I think to minimize on that potential by giving it a confined mechanical niche. I wanted Wits to be the stat for aiming and to see if the kids knew how to build some of the homealone style traps. Maybe that to needs a specific kind of rule.
Root Around was a something that has come from other games. I believe Maze Rats and Troika use similar systems without too much issue. I guess neither of those systems necessitated the use of items so much as this one will, though so I can see your point.
How would you integrate A Deal into the roll? I was thinking it could apply a -4 to the roll so that players would know exactly what they were in for, but I also kind of like the uncertainty of it. It feels like that would add drama to its use, hopefully off balancing the issue of multiple rolls. I could have players declare that they are using A Deal before the roll and have them just roll 2d20 and take the lower Advantage style. But I am not sure.
I understand not wanting to not even have a damage in the game. My reservation is not so much about wanting to keep them is that, at a point, it is about realism. Children can use weapons to deadly effect in the right circumstance. When I ran my Trail of Breadcrumbs game, I was a little taken a back when the players became very violent because that was a game without any explicit damage dice. I had a hatchet be an item the kids could have because I thought it would be a useful item for building traps with. When one of my players swung their hatchet at a witch, I said as much, but she, having grown up on a farm, said that a hatchet was a perfectly viable weapon for a child to use. To be honest, I had no counter argument so having a very weak damage die as a part of the game seems like a way of cutting that debate off at the pass by giving into the realism just a little while still ensuring that this was a sub-optimal tool for most situations. Though maybe there is a better way of doing so.
Root Around: I'm pretty sure I own Troika and maybe also Maze of Rats, I know I backed the kickstarter for the new version of Troika, but either I never got around to reading it or don't remember haha. I've never played it in any case, although I hear great things about both systems.
DeleteA deal with Sam Slick: Personally I think something like what you suggested for having "A Deal" be made before the first roll with 2d20 take the lower system (or just with a negative modifier) would be better than multiple rolls. Personally I think even a deterministic outcome after the roll would be preferable to two rolls, but that may be personal preference, but in any case if you do want a degree of variability I still personally think it would be better to fold it into a single roll.
Damage: I'm not sure if a low damage die for a hatchet is really appealing to realism haha. I think you could sort of do something like the fables comics, where there is sort of a fairtytale/cartoon-logic to how physical damage affects them, since they're more like metaphysical beings. It's almost like Undertale too, where a pure human spirit is more dangerous to monsters than any physical weapon per se. A child attempting to murder a monster is not behaving very "child-like", and therefore has less impact against a monster. A child conceiving an elaborate trap or contriving a weapon from household items is much more dangerous to a monster.
On the matter of damage, I would justify the same damage die across the board the same way class damage works in something like Dungeon World. It isn't exactly realistic but in the fumbling hands of a child versus an actively hostile enemy, it would make sense to hurt but it would be difficult for a child to actually kill a monster or even an adult this way. I agree that I would largely prefer pcs to play the game with makeshifts traps, friendship, and cunning and perhaps the inclusion of damage at all would hurt that.
DeleteI guess I really don't know. Part of me rubs the wrong way of childishness being the main weapon because it seems a little story gamey plus I was going to make use of some regular adults that would be hostile.
I think it will require playtesting to come to a real conclusion. We are getting into territory of how far game mechanics create player actions or how much the rules must be decided by the demands of player expectations. I will probably jot down a quick adventure and do a play test sometime soon. I would love to get you along!
I think what you're saying totally makes sense too, I don't mean to be pushing the "no damage" thing too much, I think it could work either way and it'll ultimately come down to testing. I'm still a bit too busy to run a game, but I think at this point I can make time to play in one, keep me in the loop :)!
DeleteSo one thing about any roll-under system is that it makes your character's effectiveness very dependent on your starting stats, and reduces or removes the importance of gaining levels as a way to get better at your skills.
ReplyDeleteThe "moves" you have here are kind of reminding me of Dungeon World. Is that deliberate?
I tried to use 2d6+4 for stats as a way of trying to make it so that starting stats would be lower so that there is room for more improvement by levels. I don't know exactly what I have in mind for advancement but stat improvement would likely be one aspect. I might also not really have a lot of impetus on advancement for this game at all. I have some ideas that will probably make it into a post soon.
DeleteThe names for the rules are kind of inspired by DW but I also just like to name stuff. These aren't meant to be limiting like PbtA can sometimes be or be interpreted as being limiting.